Used Auto Taxes

[HAZZARDJOHN]

You know how many millionaires I hear say, I made it with points. You are right mark, I am getting one today and maxing it out monthly spending thousands to make hundreds! Good plan. I am pretty sure that is how Bill Gates did it.

[HAZZARDJOHN]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U2jHCvLQ078

^ This.

[NOTNSS]

You know how many millionaires I hear say, I made it with points. You are right mark, I am getting one today and maxing it out monthly spending thousands to make hundreds! Good plan. I am pretty sure that is how Bill Gates did it.

You spend money everyday, why not get something extra for buying things? I'm a huge proponent of using credit cards wisely, the trick is to pay them off monthly so you're not paying interest which negates their benefits. You'd be surprised at what points will get you.

[HAZZARDJOHN]

I am ok with people doing it (I won't) but Statistically you spend 22% more using a credit card. Go ahead use, but when I hear someone brag about their points or mileage, I just laugh and think of the thousands they had to spend to get it. I guarantee I make more money by not using a credit card than they will ever give you. Seriously the reason they do it, is not because they are nice guys, it is because they know over 80% of people with a credit card eventually hold a balance over. Almost all of them said at one time "I will pay it off every month". They will get their money and they have people a lot smarter than you and I playing these games to get you to spend more. Play by their rules if you want, but I have done far better since I changed the game than I ever did with a credit card. $250 a year is chump change.

Trust me, I know what works because I have read, studied, and analyzed this more than anything I have ever thrown myself into. I almost lost my house once because of a bad financial situation and it will never happen again (too much consumer debt, was fine with monthly payments until 2008 when they cut my pay) It didn't almost implode until 2011 when my rental house was trashed. Financial security is not something I play with nor should anyone else IMO. The savings rate in this country is abysmal because of Credit Cards and easy financing. More than 50% of the people on this site have no net worth, meaning they owe as much as they have or even owe more. I owe about $100K on a 200K house and everything else I own. I got out of debt three years ago and invest 33% of my income. I have 6 months of expenses in the bank for emergencies. I have sinking funds for home improvements and repairs. Three years ago I had a tiny 401K and an IRA, and about 35K in consumer debt. I may not have a $60K mustang that would be obsolete in a week, but I think I have done alright for myself without having a credit card sin 2013.

[NOTNSS]

I am ok with people doing it (I won't) but Statistically you spend 22% more using a credit card. Go ahead use, but when I hear someone brag about their points or mileage, I just laugh and think of the thousands they had to spend to get it. I guarantee I make more money by not using a credit card than they will ever give you. Seriously the reason they do it, is not because they are nice guys, it is because they know over 80% of people with a credit card eventually hold a balance over. Almost all of them said at one time "I will pay it off every month". They will get their money and they have people a lot smarter than you and I playing these games to get you to spend more. Play by their rules if you want, but I have done far better since I changed the game than I ever did with a credit card. $250 a year is chump change.

Statistically yes, but again the key is being responsible. I agree $250/year is chump change, I get far more than that by being smart with using it. For instance I have tickets to Fiji & New Zealand coming up in business class, I used points, the cash equivalent would be $5k/ticket, the return I'm coming back in first class from Australia, cash price would've been $8k/ticket. And fwiw I do invest my money (eg. 401k maxed every year since 2000) and have a nice nest egg set aside, the points just allow me to save that cash for later in life.

[HAZZARDJOHN]

I will never recommend that to someone as it is a dangerous game for little reward. However if it works for you great. I will pay for my own tickets out of the 18% I earned last year if I want. I don't accept the risk of a credit card even though I am sure I am responsible enough. For them to give you 8k worth of anything you had to spend a small fortune. Not worth it to me. Retiring with dignity is more important. I am sure I won't change your mind, but you will never get me to endorse debt of anykind (including a house, I hate my mortgage that is why I am busting it out as fast as I can)

I don't have rich relatives, or anyone other than public schools to teach me about money, so I played the "normal" game for way too long and if I would have started this when I was 22 (out of college) I would easily have a mil net worth without breaking a sweat. so I have to make my net worth myself in a very short time as I started at 31 years old and got debt free before 32.

FTR, I am working on being a Financial coach and I have been counseling people for the last year. So far my friends who I have worked with have paid off about $20K in debt and all have a small emergency fund started.

[Drunko McMoppo]

Oh but the points! I just became debt free this year and it was because of credit card points.

[HAZZARDJOHN]

Oh but the points! I just became debt free this year and it was because of credit card points.

I wonder if I can get enough points to pay off my 100K mortgage.... Maybe is I spend half a mil.

[tim]

Oh but the points! I just became debt free this year and it was because of credit card points.

I dont think anyone here is talking about getting rich or anything like that from CC perks. If you spend 1000/mo on your day to day expenses, like food, gas, utilities, and stuff like that what does it matter if you use a card and earn some rewards vs paying cash directly? What if you paid it off immediately as you accrued it, pretty easy to do now with phone apps and such?

I guess I dont see the issue if you arent accruing interest?

[HAZZARDJOHN]

I dont think anyone here is talking about getting rich or anything like that from CC perks. If you spend 1000/mo on your day to day expenses, like food, gas, utilities, and stuff like that what does it matter if you use a card and earn some rewards vs paying cash directly? What if you paid it off immediately as you accrued it, pretty easy to do now with phone apps and such?

I guess I dont see the issue if you arent accruing interest?

Watch that video. I would say the people who never spend an extra dime using plastic, and never carry a balance are in the single digits percentile. They have teams of people that's only job is to get you to buy more things with their card. It is a fact that your mind does not process an electronic exchange like it does with cash. I have a debit card for things like pay at the pump and internet shopping, but I pay cash for everything else. Your mind actually senses pain when you hand over money in exchange for goods and services, their is a physical transaction, you see something leave that is never coming back. Because of this you tend to spend more wisely than using plastic with no connection to your purchase. Finance is 80% behavior, 20% head knowledge. Look I know most people are not on this program and you can not sell it to people who worship their CC's but the math is just not on their side. You might be the one that doesn't spend extra and never runs a balance, but the odds are you are not and will eventually falter.

[NOTNSS]

I will never recommend that to someone as it is a dangerous game for little reward. However if it works for you great. I will pay for my own tickets out of the 18% I earned last year if I want. I don't accept the risk of a credit card even though I am sure I am responsible enough. For them to give you 8k worth of anything you had to spend a small fortune. Not worth it to me. Retiring with dignity is more important. I am sure I won't change your mind, but you will never get me to endorse debt of anykind (including a house, I hate my mortgage that is why I am busting it out as fast as I can)

I don't have rich relatives, or anyone other than public schools to teach me about money, so I played the "normal" game for way too long and if I would have started this when I was 22 (out of college) I would easily have a mil net worth without breaking a sweat. so I have to make my self worth myself in a very short time as I started at 31 years old and got debt free at 32.

FTR, I am working on being a Financial coach and I have been counseling people for the last year. So far my friends who I have worked with have paid off about $20K in debt and all have a small emergency fund started.

I'm not looking to change your mind at all, I'm very well aware of your history and experiences that have led you to your current beliefs, I'm merely pointing out that in some cases there are benefits. That being said I'll be the first to admit that my situation is far from the norm, and you are correct there are risks involved if people aren't responsible and very strict. I would also agree that focusing on debt reduction/elimination should be a priority for everyone, and it would be nice if schools spent more time focusing on real world economics than on fluff classes like art.

[HAZZARDJOHN]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlUIOxQr3bo

^ This guy has a half mil net worth never making over $12 an hour raising kids and owns his own home (meaning his net worth is probably more than half a mil). I did not once hear him say credit card points.

That being said, I do not advise 100% what he does. He buys single stocks. That is too risky for me, I love mutual funds. When people say I have all my retirement in 3M stock or what not like it is a good thing, I remind them that there were people who had their entire retirement in Enron stock thinking it would never fail.

[95.0mark]

Watch that video. I would say the people who never spend an extra dime using plastic, and never carry a balance are in the single digits percentile. They have teams of people that's only job is to get you to buy more things with their card. It is a fact that your mind does not process an electronic exchange like it does with cash. I have a debit card for things like pay at the pump and internet shopping, but I pay cash for everything else. Your mind actually senses pain when you hand over money in exchange for goods and services, their is a physical transaction, you see something leave that is never coming back. Because of this you tend to spend more wisely than using plastic with no connection to your purchase. Finance is 80% behavior, 20% head knowledge. Look I know most people are not on this program and you can not sell it to people who worship their CC's but the math is just not on their side. You might be the one that doesn't spend extra and never runs a balance, but the odds are you are not and will eventually falter.

The thing is my mind does process it the same and I've never once had a balance on any credit card. I've never paid one penny in interest and I buy almost everything I ever need on a credit card.

Sometimes I transfer the funds the same day to pay it off. I actually never even wait for a bill. I've never actually received a bill due. I pay it off before that.

The 250 I redeemed was not for a year and only on one card. But it was 250.00 free dollars I would never have received if I paid cash. Even though I basically did pay cash because I can literally go on mobile banking and trans funds. Takes a second.

You're right though that a lot of ppl talk about their points but also carry a balance so it will never work out for those ppl.

A credit card is far safer then cash too.

I will usually keep about 40-50 in cash only and that lasts at least a month sometimes two. For a beer maybe or some very small purchase or a quick taco bell run ect.

[HAZZARDJOHN]

I'm not looking to change your mind at all, I'm very well aware of your history and experiences that have led you to your current beliefs, I'm merely pointing out that in some cases there are benefits. That being said I'll be the first to admit that my situation is far from the norm, and you are correct there are risks involved if people aren't responsible and very strict. I would also agree that focusing on debt reduction/elimination should be a priority for everyone, and it would be nice if schools spent more time focusing on real world economics than on fluff classes like art.

I know you are the rare person who seems to have a handle on it and I know other people who do as well, but as a financial counselor I would never recommend credit card miles/points. The whole reason they exist is to get you into debt. If that wasn't the goal they would not do it. Most people who play that game end up in debt which costs them a lot more in the long run.

[HAZZARDJOHN]

The thing is my mind does process it the same and I've never once had a balance on any credit card. I've never paid one penny in interest and I buy almost everything I ever need on a credit card.

Sometimes I transfer the funds the same day to pay it off. I actually never even wait for a bill. I've never actually received a bill due. I pay it off before that.

The 250 I redeemed was not for a year and only on one card. But it was 250.00 free dollars I would never have received if I paid cash. Even though I basically did pay cash because I can literally go on mobile banking and trans funds. Takes a second.

You're right though that a lot of ppl talk about their points but also carry a balance so it will never work out for those ppl.

A credit card is far safer then cash too.

I will usually keep about 40-50 in cash only and that lasts at least a month sometimes two. For a beer maybe or some very small purchase or a quick taco bell run ect.

Once again, if you are in the single digit percentile good for you, but to advise it to other people is wrong. When I say I pay cash I never carry anymore than I need (usually under $100), however I could get cash real quick if I needed more. Debit cards you have the same problem as a credit card, you spend more than you think you are because of the emotional detachment. 22% more by most studies. When I switched to cash I resisted for all the reasons you champion, however when I did I saved hundreds of dollars a month and I really do not feel like I have anything less than I did.

Debit cards are just as safe as a credit card if it is a Visa or Mastercard. By law they have to have the same fraud protections that a Credit card does. The only issue I could see is if someone got your number and wiped out your account, it would be a day or two before the money would be put back. I don't care because I have several accounts as well as other locations with money at an instance and none of my checking accounts have a tie to any of my savings account so if they stole it they would be disappointed with their 300 to 500 that I have in my checking.